New cell tech for solar

[Ron Whitfield]

It keeps getting better www.truthout.org/110508EA

Now if they could get high wind energy scaled down from those immense wind mills.

[Composite 2992]

Re: New cell tech for solar

With a 40% increase in photon absorbtion, I wonder if there's a proportional increase in power output?

[Nords]

Re: New cell tech for solar

It keeps getting better www.truthout.org/110508EA

Now if they could get high wind energy scaled down from those immense wind mills.

I wish these press releases of amazing tech discoveries had a followup every year or two. It seems very difficult to find out when/where it ends up in the actul product. I remember all the announcements about amorphous polysilicon and multi-layer technology, yet the retail panels still aren't much more efficient than those 10 years ago.

Panel technology aside, we need to get rid of the vog. Our array production is down 10-20% from last year.

Now if they could get high wind energy scaled down from those immense wind mills.

http://www.helixwind.com/en/

[salmoned]

Re: New cell tech for solar

I know great things are happening all the time, but if I can't get my hands on it, it's of little use to me. What if this new surface degrades in 12 to 18 months due to weathering? Bottom line - not of current interest.

[Ron Whitfield]

Well then...

...maybe you'd be interested in some hand fans I have for real cheap.

Nords, I like those. I made a small 'farmers' style/reverse Vornado wind mill for mounting on the roof once that worked pretty well. But the battery reserves have got to get better.

[Nords]

Re: Well then...

But the battery reserves have got to get better.

I don't think that's going to change anytime soon. The submarine force has been coping with lead-acid batteries for over a century of only incremental improvements. I don't think NiMh or Li-ion are ready yet-- if there was better technology available then it'd be retrofitted as fast as they could cycle the drydocks.

Grid-tied seems to be the way to go for photovoltaics & wind, probably for at least the next decade. If someone couldn't live without electricity for a few days then it'd be cheaper & less hassle to have a gasoline-powered generator.

[matapule]

Re: Well then...

Grid-tied seems to be the way to go for photovoltaics & wind, probably for at least the next decade. If someone couldn't live without electricity for a few days then it'd be cheaper & less hassle to have a gasoline-powered generator.

I'm a novice in all of this, but I am fascinated by the discussion. Keep it going!

[Composite 2992]

Re: New cell tech for solar

Nano lithium batteries by A123 Systems have a fast recharge capability, good capacity and a high number of cycles. A company built a battery system for the Toyota Prius which gives the car the ability to run 100% on electricity. When the juice runs out the gas engine kicks in.

There's another new battery technology that uses nano-silicon filaments which is supposed to be even better. Still in the development stage.

http://www.edn.com/blog/1470000147/post/1940019194.html

The limitation for now is cost. Lead acid is cheaper but the number of cycles is fairly short, in the hundreds. Some of these nano-technology lithiums have the potential to go well over a thousand charge/discharge cycles.

BTW, even without advanced solar cell technology, it's possible to power a home today. I did the math for our house and, even with a 5,000 BTU air conditioner running all day (I work at home and need the room to be below 80 degrees for the computers), it would be possible to provide power to run the entire house. The problem is that such a system is about $50,000.

Still waiting for the panel price to go down or my income to go up. :-)

[Nords]

Re: New cell tech for solar

Nano lithium batteries by A123 Systems have a fast recharge capability, good capacity and a high number of cycles. A company built a battery system for the Toyota Prius which gives the car the ability to run 100% on electricity. When the juice runs out the gas engine kicks in.

I've been watching them roll that out. I think aftermarket businesses like A123 are keeping Toyota from resting on their hybrid laurels.

BTW, even without advanced solar cell technology, it's possible to power a home today. I did the math for our house and, even with a 5,000 BTU air conditioner running all day (I work at home and need the room to be below 80 degrees for the computers), it would be possible to provide power to run the entire house. The problem is that such a system is about $50,000.
Still waiting for the panel price to go down or my income to go up. :-)

If you're going to be living at the same location for a couple decades then waiting might work against you. When we started installing our system in 2004/5, Oahu electricity was selling at 16 cents/KWHr. Today HECO claims that it's more like 30 cents/KWHr.

One option would be to buy used or cosmetically-blemished panels off Craigslist or eBay. (Evergreen Solar sells blemished, but still fully-rated panels, through Sun Electronics in Miami and maybe other retailers.) You'd have to find an electrician willing to work with you to mount the inverter and wire it into your service connection (like Keith Cronin at Sun Edison's Island Energy Solutions). The payback for used/blemished panels and electricians-by-the-hour is about 5-10 years.

Even if you go full retail, the payback is less than 20 years. The payback calculators rarely include an inflation estimate so, assuming rising oil prices and dropping dollars, the actual payback is at least a few years shorter. And then you'll enjoy nearly free electricity (and hybrid battery charges) for another couple decades beyond that...

[GeckoGeek]

Re: New cell tech for solar

I just can't get excited about photo voltaic. Even if the issues of cost and performance are worked out, there's still that minor little problem of storing energy. No one has yet come up with a good cost-effective way to do that on a large scale. It's the same problem that's plagued the electric car.

In the end, photo voltaic is a good conservation source, but it's not really an alternative. And it doesn't really lessen our dependence. (I don't buy the newspeak that reducing imports reduces "dependence". I look at dependence as how screwed you are if it's cut off.)

Then there's the whole issue of class struggle. Just who is going to be able to put up solar cells? House owners. Not renters, not apartment dwellers. It will just turn into another "the rich get richer".

Frankly, I think the best move is to work on biofuels. The two big problems with our present hydrocarbon fuel system is that: 1) We buy it from foreign nations and 2) We are taking carbon from the ground and disbursing it in the air. (That is if you're a believer of global warming.) Being able to manufacture our own biofuel would solve both problems and make energy affordable to ALL classes. AND allow us to use our exiting transportation infrastructure rather then replace it all (which again, the poor can not afford to do.) There have been some promising developments that work in the lab and now they're working on scaling up to production level. That's where I think we need to concentrate on.

I'd much rather see the state spend money on research (for a cut of any licensing rights) then fund what ultimately looks like a dead-end.