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  • Re: Rail Transit

    Originally posted by AlohaKine View Post
    Let the people vote on it. It's our 4$B+. I think it should be built with private funds. If it will be such a winner, investors will come pouring in to "get on the train before it leaves the station". I hear the thing will have a fare box. Why can't they go to a BANK instead of the taxpayer.
    I would support the public having a say if all proposals were put on the table. An up or down vote solely on the city's current mass transit proposal really doesn't really give the electorate that much of a choice. What would be the City's option if the electorate were to support the initiative? That question really hasn't been answered. Plus the definition of "Train" is not clearly defined....too much ambiguity here.

    I'd have to do a little more research to say for sure but I'd be willing to guess that no LRT has ever been built using only private funds. Most systems are paid for and maintained with Federal, State, and Local subsidies.

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    • Re: Rail Transit

      hi this is sansei and in response to keanu,i'd vote yes since i want rail to be built and not to wait for another 16-20 year's so i thought to share this with you and everyone.

      well thank's for your time:O)

      Comment


      • Re: Rail Transit

        Originally posted by sansei View Post
        hi this is sansei and in response to keanu,i'd vote yes since i want rail to be built . . . :O)
        Sansei, I know you are in favor of rail, but if you vote "Yes," you'll actually be voting AGAINST rail, if what Keanu is saying is true. Read the question carefully.

        I think the wording on the ballot is going to be a big issue. A lot of people in favor of rail might vote against it, unintentionally.

        Originally posted by Keanu View Post
        The Charter question (as proposed by Stop Rail) states... SHALL AN ORDINANCE BE ADOPTED TO PROHIBIT TRAINS AND RAIL TRANSIT IN THE CITY AND COUNTY OF HONOLULU?

        Comment


        • Re: Rail Transit

          Originally posted by Keanu View Post
          Make sure you read the Charter question clearly, sansei, if Stop Rail Now's initiative goes on the ballot.The Charter question (as proposed by Stop Rail) states... SHALL AN ORDINANCE BE ADOPTED TO PROHIBIT TRAINS AND RAIL TRANSIT IN THE CITY AND COUNTY OF HONOLULU? You would want to vote no.
          Does that also includes the Pearlridge Monorail? I vote YES. Prohibit existing and future rails!!!

          Why stop there? Prohibit wheeled automative vehicles!!!! BWAH-HAHAHAHA!!!
          Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

          Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

          Comment


          • Re: Rail Transit

            Originally posted by Keanu View Post
            Make sure you read the Charter question clearly, sansei, if Stop Rail Now's initiative goes on the ballot.The Charter question (as proposed by Stop Rail) states... SHALL AN ORDINANCE BE ADOPTED TO PROHIBIT TRAINS AND RAIL TRANSIT IN THE CITY AND COUNTY OF HONOLULU? You would want to vote no.
            Yep, the very reason why I don't support SRN's initiative. It's not about the public's interest but special interest. Otherwise, why the deceitful wording, just like how they did ask for a special election in their petition wording and now backtrack. These same guys are linked to honolulutraffic and early in their campaign, they only spoke of a HOT solution. But when people started asking meaningful questions, they started including the concept of express buses and BRT. These were the same guys who were against the BRT a couple years back. They're just selling whatever it takes to get what they want. Masters of propaganda. I wonder if Oahu will be duped by them or not. Hopefully, the council pushes on with their own vote initiative so the wording can be more straightforward.

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            • Re: Rail Transit

              Originally posted by Random View Post
              Does that also includes the Pearlridge Monorail? I vote YES. Prohibit existing and future rails!!!

              Why stop there? Prohibit wheeled automative vehicles!!!!
              Slightly offtopic but what's significant about 4-15-89 for Tienanmen in your sig? Shouldn't it be 6-4?

              Comment


              • Re: Rail Transit

                Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
                Slightly offtopic but what's significant about 4-15-89 for Tienanmen in your sig? Shouldn't it be 6-4?
                It should, but the protest started on 4-15.
                Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

                Comment


                • Re: Rail Transit

                  Originally posted by Honoruru View Post

                  I think the wording on the ballot is going to be a big issue. A lot of people in favor of rail might vote against it, unintentionally.
                  The cynical side of me thinks that is exactly what the SRN leadership is hoping for. I can't help but think lot of good people are being duped here. I encourage every voter to research the pros and cons of the initiative before casting their vote, should the charter amendment make it to the ballots.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Rail Transit

                    Originally posted by Keanu View Post
                    The cynical side of me thinks that is exactly what the SRN leadership is hoping for.
                    Why those sneaky little bastard, that is SRN...

                    Damn furriners.

                    Gawd, I hate question that begins with "Shall..." Any lawmaker or lawyer even start with that should be shot on sight.

                    Make it simple, "Do you want public rail transit now or never?"

                    Can we sue the SRN to make them change the "Shall" question?
                    Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                    Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

                    Comment


                    • Re: Rail Transit

                      Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
                      Yep, the very reason why I don't support SRN's initiative. It's not about the public's interest but special interest. Otherwise, why the deceitful wording, just like how they did ask for a special election in their petition wording and now backtrack. These same guys are linked to honolulutraffic and early in their campaign, they only spoke of a HOT solution. But when people started asking meaningful questions, they started including the concept of express buses and BRT. These were the same guys who were against the BRT a couple years back. They're just selling whatever it takes to get what they want. Masters of propaganda. I wonder if Oahu will be duped by them or not. Hopefully, the council pushes on with their own vote initiative so the wording can be more straightforward.
                      Council will probably keep their proposals on the table as a safety valve while the Charter initiative is being reviewed.

                      I share your sentiments regarding SRN.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Rail Transit

                        Originally posted by Keanu View Post
                        SHALL AN ORDINANCE BE ADOPTED TO PROHIBIT TRAINS AND RAIL TRANSIT IN THE CITY AND COUNTY OF HONOLULU?
                        If the proper answer has to be explained, then the question is poorly worded.

                        The question should simply be: Should Honolulu have a rail transit system? Simple "yes" or "no".

                        Otherwise, let's make it really confusing and ask, "Are you opposed to the initiative which declares Honolulu shall not have a rail transit system?"

                        And if it's "yes" to the rail, the decision for steel or rubber wheels should be left up to engineers who know what they're doing, not to the general public that's badly misinformed.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Rail Transit

                          After listening to both sides, Sakamoto pulled out his notes on a yellow legal pad and read a prepared statement. He had harsh words for the city for attempting to keep the question off of the general election ballot: “The voice of the people should not be suffocated by erroneous rulings of the law by its own government. The city clerk shall immediately cease any continuing refusal to accept the petition," Sakamoto said.


                          Hmmm, so it appears the judge already made up his mind even before lawyers from both sides could make their opening statements? Another farce trial in court.

                          Link

                          Comment


                          • Re: Rail Transit

                            Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
                            After listening to both sides, Sakamoto pulled out his notes on a yellow legal pad and read a prepared statement. He had harsh words for the city for attempting to keep the question off of the general election ballot: “The voice of the people should not be suffocated by erroneous rulings of the law by its own government. The city clerk shall immediately cease any continuing refusal to accept the petition," Sakamoto said.


                            Hmmm, so it appears the judge already made up his mind even before lawyers from both sides could make their opening statements? Another farce trial in court.

                            Link
                            FIRE SAKAMOTO!!! I no care if losing his judge's salary will force his children to attend public school.

                            I feel sorry for Denise DeCosta. To have her name dragged into this while she was just performing her duty. A shame to SRN.


                            BOO!!! BOO!!! BOO!!!
                            Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                            Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

                            Comment


                            • Re: Rail Transit

                              "Alicia Maluafiti, spokesperson for Support Rail Transit, issued the following statement in response to the decision by Circuit Court Judge Karl Sakamoto."

                              “The judge’s decision makes it all the more important that our city council adopt a ballot measure for a charter amendment that will enable the people of Oahu to vote for a solution to our traffic congestion problems. The petition submitted by Stop Rail Now offers no solution to the horrendous traffic problems we face now, which will only grow worse in the future. The Stop Rail Now initiative would take us back to square one. And we need relief as soon as possible.

                              “The rail transit project is the only viable option available. There is no federal money for another solution and no other solution has been identified and gone through the vetting process.

                              “Rail transit is not only our last best mobility option, it is the only thing on the horizon that offers hope for our sinking economy. It’s the one initiative that will make up for the jobs lost in our travel and tourism industry. It’s also our best hope for controlling growth and keeping the country through transit oriented development.

                              “We are counting on our city council to have the foresight and political will to recognize what’s at stake and give the voters of Oahu a real choice to vote for a transit solution in November.”

                              Go Rail Go!

                              No Spur in Salt Lake!!
                              btw: http://www.homespunhonolulu.com/aunty-runs-for-office/
                              Be AKAMAI ~ KOKUA Hawai`i!
                              Philippians 4:13 --- I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Rail Transit

                                I'm close to the Stop Rail Now folks and they are NOT special interests.

                                They are taxpayers who have studied rail and know that it has NOT alleviated traffic in ANY U.S. city.

                                They use U.S. Dept. of Transportation figures, not their own. Average ridership in the U.S. is in the 3 - 5 % range.

                                Even Hannemann's own projections are that 7% will use it.

                                SRN opposes rail in Honolulu because it would be a huge waste of money.

                                We're distant from other cities with rail. It looks good to casual observers or on paper. But once they are built, they have NO NOTICEABLE impact on traffic.

                                There are much better solutions:
                                1) Dedicated lanes
                                2) Four day work weeks
                                3) Better traffic management
                                4) Staggered work/school hours
                                5) Moving jobs to where people live rather than vice versa.

                                All of these cost less and are more effective than rail.

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