Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

My take on the events of my life don't seem to jive with yours.

Psst...Richard...
You mean "jibe," not "jive."
Really.
http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/inde...?date=20000711
Just tryin' to help.

Carry on...

[buzz1941]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

This is completely irrelevant. You can put breaking news items on the web page, which generally doesn’t require “waiting until print.” Breaking news rarely employs photos or graphics.

The bottom line is you hold the reader hostage by “sitting” on the latest news when it could be divulged. Or is it because you are waiting for the Honolulu Advertiser to break the news first, so you can compare notes?

Jeez. More baiting from the peanut gallery. In this case, "jive" may be accurate...

The Advertiser may actually post "breaking news" on their Web site, but it's well-hidden among the unedited press releases and gratuitous promoter fluff. Considering the size of their online staff, they really should add basic content editing to their mission statement. It's GIGO all the way there.

I can't really imagine "breaking news" on TV without video. Sometime the news that's breaking is actually visual in nature.

Also -- basic business sense here -- if you want to sell printed newspapers, don't give it away first. That includes the lovely photographs produced by the Star-Bulletin staff. There are many ways the two newspapers are comparable, but not in photojournalism or informational graphics. The Star-Bulletin totally rules in visual journalism.

But the two newspapers aren't comparable in resources. The Gannett Advertiser has a huge staff and vast resources compared to the Star-Bulletin. The Star-Bulletin is still around because of judicious financial management and because of a clear-eyed reading of current economic conditions. Newspapers are a business, not a charity.

Holding the readers "hostage"? Goodness. Angry about something?

Besides, by the time readers plow through the Advertiser's slow and cluttered Website, picking their way through the crumbling mountain of publicist debris they call content, the SB stuff is up and running. With a staff a quarter the size of theirs.

[Kimo]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Actually, Buzz, I was thinking what you really meant was "bating..." rather than baiting. But then I looked it up, and you're probably right, altho' an unusual use of the word....

[buzz1941]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Yep, baiting, as in raw meat to a hungry dawg. "Bating" means to lessen, as in the root of rebate, or abates.

[TuNnL]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

More baiting from the peanut gallery.

Eh, unlike many on this board, I’m willing to admit that’s what I’m doing.

The Advertiser may actually post "breaking news" on their Web site, but it's well-hidden among the unedited press releases and gratuitous promoter fluff. Considering the size of their online staff, they really should add basic content editing to their mission statement. It's GIGO all the way there.

LMAO! That’s probably the funniest thing I’ve read this week. It’s always the writers with the sense of humor.

...you want to sell printed newspapers... But the two newspapers aren't comparable in resources. The Gannett Advertiser has a huge staff and vast resources compared to the Star-Bulletin. The Star-Bulletin is still around because of judicious financial management and because of a clear-eyed reading of current economic conditions.

Don’t you see though, Burl, that this is an apologist attitude. Just surviving is not enough. IMHO, the chance Star-Bulletin has better coverage than the Advertiser on any given day is less than 50/50.

Therefore, finding even the niche market depends on beating the Advertiser in other ways. You and Walker seem to think the web isn’t the answer. But splashy graphics and visual layout may win you an award at the SPJ dinner. In my view, the readers don’t give a rip. It’s a more relevant tool for the advertising department.

Newspapers are a business, not a charity.

No kidding. And if SB doesn’t do something soon, they'll be out of it.

Besides, by the time readers plow through the Advertiser's slow and cluttered Website, picking their way through the crumbling mountain of publicist debris they call content, the SB stuff is up and running.

It’s true much of this kapakahi mess are the spare press releases that didn’t merit a read beyond the lead. But surely you must realize that some of this ‘community content’ is genuinely important to the significant niche market SB gave up when RFD Publications axed the Sun Press.

[Composite 2992]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

The one thing that the Bulletin missed since being run by the Canadians is the option of becoming an AM paper.

The bulk of the entire edition is running on the press by midnight. Why not deliver it to the larger market, rather than let it all go stale by the afternoon?

[buzz1941]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Actually, the Star-Bulletin began printing morning editions immediately after the JOA divorce. In almost every community except downtown, home delivery is in the morning.

The Advertiser did the same thing, but in the afternoons. They gave up after a while.

[buzz1941]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Don’t you see though, Burl, that this is an apologist attitude. Just surviving is not enough. IMHO, the chance Star-Bulletin has better coverage than the Advertiser on any given day is less than 50/50.

Nope it's reality. Newspapers are paring down all over. The Advertiser is trying to become more like us than we are trying to be like them in terms of resources and staffing. The time when Gannett could pour cash into simply trying to kill a competitor is fast ticking away. ("Just surviving" is a miracle these days, when the largest newspaper chain in the world is trying to kill you!)

[dick]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

You and Walker seem to think the web isn’t the answer.

Not sure where you came to that conclusion, but whatever. Oh yeah, we didn't agree with you and your supreme knowledge of everything.

Oh, and I'm still waiting on my work history since you claim to know so much about me. Spill the beans, dude! Oh wait... you think I'm "straight out of Ka Leo." What was I thinking?

Yet another troll who hides behind a sad internet persona.

Step up to the mic, dude. If you got the tamas to make wild accusations, at least do it in public.

Thanks for the laffs.

Okay, back to topic...

I prefer the Star-Bulletin.

[TuNnL]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

You and Walker seem to think the web isn’t the answer.

Not sure where you came to that conclusion, but whatever.

Well, let me spell it out for you. According to your own posts, it’s acceptable to you that Honolulu Advertiser gets its content up first. You rationalize it by some fictional AM/PM argument, even though as Burl has pointed out, in almost every community except downtown, home delivery of SB is in the morning. (I myself try to get to the gym early enough, or all the free SB on the rack will be gone. Good job! At least SB has proven it can GIVE its product away) And you tell me I am the one who doesn’t know how a newsroom works because you have only worked in newsrooms (besides a brief stint at the Advertiser) that incorporate, as Leo Lakio says, “old business models.” News flash, dick: These media entities are dropping like flies. Times are changing.

So let’s dispense with the shibai. You have continued to dance around what you know is my basic point, by making this thread about you. And they say T.V. people are the one with the big egos. It’s not about you, dick. Get over yourself.

[Media Guy]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Wow, so much for a civil discussion on which paper members of this thread prefer.

Personally, I like each paper for their different strengths.
The Tiser has a much larger circulation, which is the key factor for my clients. I have a long time business association with SB and the long-forgotten RFD publications, so I have a biased allegiance there, but I do like that the Tisers' website has more up-to-date breaking stories. The Advertiser's print quality is worlds apart when compared to the Bulletin's, but I enjoy the journalistic quality of the SB more so than the Advertiser.

I stopped subscriptions to both papers at home and at the office a year ago and just read them online or get updates on my cell unless I pick one up at the gym or the Plaza Club, but for the past month I seem to get a Bulletin in my driveway every morning. I guess just like MidWeek I get it whether I want it or not. Which isn't neccessarily a bad thing. I like it that Honolulu is a two-paper town, and that the SB has survived Gannett's "Drain the Pond" business model, is in itself remarkable.

[Composite 2992]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Actually, the Star-Bulletin began printing morning editions immediately after the JOA divorce. In almost every community except downtown, home delivery is in the morning.

The Advertiser did the same thing, but in the afternoons. They gave up after a while.

For the first few years morning delivery was a mere token on the Windward side. The bulk of deliveries were made in the afternoon. The second home update was just a few changes unless major news broke.

Maybe that's changed in the past year or two, but it was definitely not getting much circulation in the AM long after the JOA was dissolved. Didn't make much sense to me but it did to whoever was in charge at the time.

If they are going mostly AM then the SB has a chance of surviving or doing better eventually.

[buzz1941]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

If they are going mostly AM then the SB has a chance of surviving or doing better eventually.

The Star-Bulletin was prevented from AM circulation by the original JOA. When that dissolved, each paper was free to pursue whatever business model was healthiest — ours was mere survival, theirs was kill the competition. We "won" by hanging on.

Actually, the citizens won. Hawaii residents get competitive ad rates and news, and that's rare in the country these days. Both papers are different, and I always urge readers to read both.

The partial AM home circulation is due mostly to a smaller press. Ours isn't as grand as the Advertiser's, but on the other hand, we're not going to still be making payments on it 20 years from now the way they are.

The Star-Bulletin's initial AM distribution was into the honor racks, not homes.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

Actually, the citizens won.

Thanks for noting that point, Buzz. There are a LOT of former two-paper towns that wish they could even have a "which do you prefer" discussion. Lucky for us in Seattle, despite plenty of recent legal fights, we're still a two-newspaper town; don't know how long that will remain, however.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Hawaii's News Papers Which do you Prefer

As a bus rider, I get as much daily/weekly print as I can, just to keep my mind off The Bus' thrilling offerings. The 2 dailies have varying amounts of read on the same stories, so you have to do both to get more on one or the other. Neither has enuf news or in-depth articles.

I favor the SB because it has way better comics. I live for Dilbert!
But, the teaser thing was a mistake. I want to read the topic once, and straight thru, not an initial tidbit on the front pages and then have to re-read to get the rest. Irritating and a waste of space. But, they give them away on The Bus for free! That still happily stuns me. Helloooo Advertiser!!

The Advertiser is accurately named. And can they waste any more paper with their Sunday edition?! Sheesh, 4/5ths goes into the trash immediately, for a $1.50?! Except for Mutts, their comics suck.

The Weekly - well, I run thru it fast these day's.

Mid-Week, I still enjoy it, especially Weird News and the recipe section. But they are stupid at the office. Won't give you one unless you have a PO box. But you can find them all over, and then they throw TONS away into the land fills every week. STUPID.