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The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

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  • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

    Frankie, just before 2PM today I was sitting in my car in front of our veterinarian's office and talking on my daughter's cell with her hubby from Iraq. My other son-in-law leaves for Iraq end-of-year time frame. While they and we all appreciate your concern for our troops a lot, I am able to report to you that most of our troops are upbeat, they say that things are truly better over there than they were two years ago during their last deployment, and not only family, but a couple of dear friends that were in Iraq recently do report that what they have done over there was/is not in vain.

    They were not drafted and went into our military by choice. One dear friend of mine has a wife that enlisted after Bush re-entered Iraq. A good number of my family's friends Re-enlisted while on tour in Iraq.

    Four thousands deaths are 4grand too many deaths while they didn't die in vain, nor were they forced into harms way.

    There are indeed worse things that a president can do than continue Iraq by not pulling out all of our troops lightening-fast.
    Stop being lost in thought where our problems thrive.~

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    • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

      Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
      Thanks for making that comment, Glossyp. It demonstrates this point I want to make, for those who still haven't gotten it yet.

      I was engaged in a discussion about US involvement in the war in Iraq. You respond by saying Obama "is doing well" and wondering why I'm not taking a "cheery approach" on this issue.

      Well Glossyp, when it comes to the war in Iraq, the first thought that comes into my mind isn't about who's winning in the polls. It's about the welfare of our servicemen and women. And I freely acknowledge not being "cheery," with the news that 4 more US soldiers were killed today, bringing up the US death toll to 4,024. To some people, those are just numbers. Hence, their talk about carrying on in Iraq until,.... whenever. Disagree with me if you want, but we are talking about American lives here. We are talking about our soldiers being stretched to the limit, with many of them already on their 3rd, 4th, and 5th tour of duty, and the deployments themselves being extended from 12 to 15 months.

      But to some other people, their response is "So what?" Yeah, way to show your support for our exhausted and overextended troops.
      Many of us, if not all, are keenly aware of the toll taken on our military.

      I would very much like US to leave Iraq but that has to be up to the Iraqis. If they prefer to call themselves Iranians and shake hands with Ahmadinejad and his "Sith Lords" Ayatollah with "Grand Moff" Al-Sadr, then so be it.
      Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

      Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

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      • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

        Originally posted by Karen View Post
        Frankie dear, have you ever heard of the term "rhetorical?" Well, I was BEING that as I spoke of the alternatives because I already know what they are. We get McMuffin and war, or one of two socialists with some extremely unAmerican agendas.

        Speaking of posturing, your question of do we want four more years of this was nothing more than that since you failed to explain to us what "other than this" will be. I don't think you know. What a candidate says and what they do is much too often far from the same, and in this case...what they say is sociallist medicine and things that will help drive the nails in the coffin of our economy.

        Baking cookies on election day sounds delicious.
        Ah, a cynic. Well, now that I know where you're coming from, what you say actually makes sense to me.

        Far be it from me to dispel you from your cynicism towards politics. It's a cesspool filled with liars, crooks, moral degenerates, and worse.

        Am I naive in believing our choice of candidates makes any difference? If you think so, then there's not much I can say to you.

        I've seen and lived through many of those scandals. Watergate. Whitewater. Iran-Contra. Abscam. Ironically enough, though, I think the most egregious political scandals take place when the politicians in office think the public is complacent and not paying attention to what is going on.

        And yet, I still believe the choices that are made on election day does make a difference.

        By getting involved in some political campaigns, I have learned first hand that not all politicians are REPUBLICRATS. They're not all the same.

        By all means, do what you feel like doing on election day. As for me, I will cast my vote. It will be just one. But it all adds up. Every little bit helps to keep those rascals in Washington in line.

        And while I'm certainly glad to hear that your family members/friends serving in the Armed Forces are doing well, keep in mind the struggle and hardships that other, less fortunate military families are enduring. Don't take my word for it. Go to http://www.vetvoice.com/ to find out their experiences, some of which are absolutely horrific.
        Last edited by Frankie's Market; April 8, 2008, 10:39 PM.
        This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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        • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

          Republicrat......hey, that's my word. Cool.
          FutureNewsNetwork.com
          Energy answers are already here.

          Comment


          • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

            Originally posted by timkona View Post
            Republicrat......hey, that's my word. Cool.
            Actually, one of the earliest cited uses of the word is from a Usenet post in 1985.

            But still cool.

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            • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

              Frankie, cynism is rampant for excellent reasons. However...mine is not so much against politics in-general as it is towards THIS race and these 3 candidates. My thoughts on it are well-founded. I do not intend to spend my entire life voting for the "lesser of evils." I didn't do that when I voted for Reagan, I really voted FOR him, not against the other guy, mainly.

              McMuffin is the lesser of evils this time and he ain't getting my vote.
              Stop being lost in thought where our problems thrive.~

              Comment


              • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
                Actually, one of the earliest cited uses of the word is from a Usenet post in 1985.

                But still cool.
                That's interesting. First time I heard of the term Republicrat was in a 1992 commercial for then-Presidential candidate Bo Gritz, who was running on the Populist Party ticket. No, it wasn't a commercial on a "regular" TV station. Apparently, somebody reserved a block of time on one of Oceanic's public access channels to play his campaign's commercials. The man was a kook. But I thought his use of the term "Republicrats" to distingiush himself from the major candidates was clever. Keep in mind that in '92, the country was so discontented with "politics as usual" that Ross Perot made his first and most viable run for President as an independent that year.
                This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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                • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                  Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
                  Thanks for making that comment, Glossyp. It demonstrates this point I want to make, for those who still haven't gotten it yet.

                  I was engaged in a discussion about US involvement in the war in Iraq. You respond by saying Obama "is doing well" and wondering why I'm not taking a "cheery approach" on this issue.
                  Yes and no. You were commenting on the war while dismissing Karen's point that she didn't view the trade off of ending the war while ushering in socialism as a particularly viable choice. My comment to you was about your rudeness which you now excuse by your all-consuming concern for our troops. I'm pretty sure you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who actually likes this war (certain corporations, enemies, etc. excepted, of course) and doesn't care about the accompanying losses and stresses which impact many families, like Karen's and others here.

                  So, we now understand the troops are your priority and you believe the only possible answer is "*gradual* withdrawal" (btw, a much more nuanced position from both HRC and BHO which contrasts rather dramatically with the six months or 90 days and we're out position previously held by the candidates) - and, if someone doesn't agree with you on the subject, they are deserving of your ire and disdain. It's always good to understand the ground rules, don't you think?

                  Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
                  As far as winning "hearts and minds," my name isn't Barack Obama. Neither am I officially associated with his campaign, either nationally or locally. He's the one running for office, not me. He has to be careful about how he delivers his message. OTOH, I have the luxury to be more blunt in making my points.
                  As HT's most vocal BHO supporter, it is clearly your choice as to how you present your support for him. And it's up to each of us following your posts to make our own judgments about the efficacy of your arguments.

                  Comment


                  • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                    Originally posted by glossyp View Post
                    Yes and no. You were commenting on the war while dismissing Karen's point that she didn't view the trade off of ending the war while ushering in socialism as a particularly viable choice. My comment to you was about your rudeness which you now excuse by your all-consuming concern for our troops.
                    Five more US soliders reported dead today. Which means that 17 soliders have died since Sunday. That brings up the grand total to 4,029 soliders all together.

                    But you're more concerned about what you think is "rudeness" on my part?

                    You've certainly got your priorities on straight.

                    What gets me is your classifying other people's feelings of concern for the dead servicemen and women as being an "excuse." Wow.

                    Originally posted by glossyp View Post
                    I'm pretty sure you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who actually likes this war (certain corporations, enemies, etc. excepted, of course) and doesn't care about the accompanying losses and stresses which impact many families, like Karen's and others here.
                    I never said otherwise. Certainly no sane American would think that US casualties would be a cause for celebration.

                    But just because that's the case, does that mean I can't speak up and say what's on my mind? Is reality a bit too hard-hitting for you? Then may I respectfully suggest that you spare yourself anguish by ignoring my posts. And I mean that sincerely. Because I'm not backing off from what I'm posting here.

                    Originally posted by glossyp View Post
                    So, we now understand the troops are your priority and you believe the only possible answer is "*gradual* withdrawal" (btw, a much more nuanced position from both HRC and BHO which contrasts rather dramatically with the six months or 90 days and we're out position previously held by the candidates) - and, if someone doesn't agree with you on the subject, they are deserving of your ire and disdain. It's always good to understand the ground rules, don't you think?
                    I'm going to continue to post my opinions as I see fit. If you're going to take disagreements with me personally, there's nothing I can do about that, except to repeat my earlier suggestion to you. Ignore what I write, if I what I have to say will upset you so.

                    Originally posted by glossyp View Post
                    As HT's most vocal BHO supporter, it is clearly your choice as to how you present your support for him. And it's up to each of us following your posts to make our own judgments about the efficacy of your arguments.
                    Thanks for the advice. I'm sure it was well meant.
                    This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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                    • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                      More mixed messages from the Clinton camp when it comes to trade agreements.

                      http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS...nton.colombia/

                      Of course, this is more than just a disagreement between an ordinary wife and husband. Whatever Hillary will say to voters about how much she's opposed to having a free trade deal with Columbia, the fact is that she and Bill were the recipient of $800,000 from a special interest group that supports a Columbian free trade agreement.

                      My prediction? This will not sit well with working class/blue collar voters in Pennsylvania, further eroding her support base in this key state. Quinnipiac's poll had Clinton leading Obama by 6 points. This is down from 9 points last week and 12 points in mid-March.
                      This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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                      • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                        Clinton campaign owes UC Davis money

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                        • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                          Obama leads Clinton

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                          • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                            Originally posted by Karen View Post
                            McMuffin is the lesser of evils this time and he ain't getting my vote.
                            So... you're not voting at all.
                            Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                            Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

                            Comment


                            • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                              Nope, not voting at all,unless given a miracle that a fourth, yet unnamed person gets the nomination for either party and that I can actually vote "for" that person and not just against the others.

                              I'm baking cookies.
                              Stop being lost in thought where our problems thrive.~

                              Comment


                              • Re: The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 2

                                Originally posted by Karen View Post
                                Nope, not voting at all,unless given a miracle that a fourth, yet unnamed person gets the nomination for either party and that I can actually vote "for" that person and not just against the others.
                                Not voting for anyone is, in itself, a choice.

                                But with that said, there's more to this year's election other than the Presidential race.
                                This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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